Now we buy so much of our clothes online I think it is time we had a TOG measurement system (like duvets) for sweaters.

I think a tog system would work for me. I have been disappointed when buying sweaters online as although they look good on the page they have always been too thin.

Today I put in the charity shop bag a Woolovers 100% wool sweater because it is just too thin. It is thickly knitted in fine wool. It is a good quality sweater, but just not warm enough, but because it was the only one I found in the right colour and style, I have tried to convince myself it was OK, but it isn't and I have stopped wearing it. I am currently wearing a dark brown polo neck which would be more comfortable if it was a bit thinner.
I found Woolovers to be very poor quality. They went into the charity shop rag bag.

Edinburgh Woollen Mills still exists but seem to be based in garden centres.

M&S does a very limited range of fine merino jumpers but I think they need a TOG rating as they're not very warm.
I notice that Benetton do merino wool polo necks too.

It’s a woman thing, I’m sure. I feel the cold badly and am always on the lookout for thick warm jumpers. But it’s rare you find such a thing for women. However, look in the men’s sections and the jumpers are much thicker and warmer. Next and M & S are guilty of this. I’d buy them but they swamp me unfortunately.

Callistemon I am currently wearing a Woolovers sweater that is a bit too thick. It is just you cannot tell how thick or thin a sweeater is going to be until it arrives.

I would say this too, to other posters. The problem is that you cannot tell how thick or thin a sweater is until it arrives - and of course at different times you are looking for thicker or thinner sweaters,

If there was a TOG rating and I wanted a really thin sweater, then I could look online and enter 'Light grey crewneck 100% wool sweater TOG 4 - and that is what I would get. Currentl I will get 50 sweaters, all plain light grey and crewnecked, either on models or flat on a surface, and it is impossible to tell which is the equivalent of TOG 4 or TOG 8.

With thicker sweaters and textured, or patterned sweaters, it is much easier to judge the thickness and warmth.

I find individual shops are little use because the range of colours they each offer is so limited and the under sweater is usually the last thing I buy to go with an outfit so by then my colour/style criteria are quite tight. I usually do generic searches and see what comes up, with a preference for retailers I recognise and have bought from before.

If a sweater seems a bit thin I just wear a lightweight thermal vest/T-shirt under it, or a shirt/gilet over it. My main complaint about sweaters is the lack of colour choice as I see a style I like but it only comes in one or two colours.

MOnica ,
I agree with you .
I've been wearing three of four layers to keep warm .
Next time , I'll buy a M and S mens jumper .
Invited out today , I might wear a dress -but my friend's house is unheated . I don't think that I can stand it .
Hopefully , the weather is warming up .
I used to go to the EW shop in Tonbridge Wells , browse the second hand book shops and then , have tea in The Pantiles - a totally blissful day out !

I spend a lot of time outdoors and for that reason choose jumpers made of cashmere or merino wool. They are not exceptionally thick, but they do the job best and they last.
Woolovers 👎
We have a new EW shop in town, but I'm not over keen these days. I've moved across to Boden and am very happy. And warm.

I was just thinking, (!!), it should be possible get TOG ratings for jumpers because we get them for woollen carpets, don't we?

I cover all the tog ratings by having jumpers of varying thickness/warmth. I wear a cotton t-shirt or vest top next to my skin, a cotton long-sleeved rolleck on top of that and then a wool jumper suitable for the season/weather.

In very cold weather, I'll wear a big, thick cardigan over all that or a sheepskin gilet.

And that's only inside!

Anyway, the point is, have a few jumpers that will cover all eventualities. Some of mine are over twenty years old, such as a Guernsey I bought in 1998 and a Norwegian thick cardigan I bought in 1999.

I wouldn't trust TOG ratings because of the huge variability of woollen garments. TOGs for duvets and carpets only have to cover a limited number of variations.

I keep the heating on - saves me buying all these expensive sweaters, which inevitably get splashed and spluttered on. 😂
And a nice warm coat for outdoors ..
TOG rating - good idea .

I'm sure some baby garments have TOG ratings.

Doesn't a TOG rating depend on type of filling and how much filling is in an item?

Duvets, puffer jackets, babies' snowsuits yes, but I'm not sure if it could be calculated for woollen garments.

Monica, a TOG rating for jumpers sounds a great idea to me! ☺

Have you tried Uniqlo and M&S Heatgen for basics? I find that both of them make useful tops that are lightweight and warm. I agree that there is no way to measure the differences between them, but you might fid something you like on both sites.

Natural fibres, such as Merino are not rated TOG because they adjust according to temperature, and this is why they are so popular.

Callistemon all duvets have TOG ratings regardless of outer cover fabric or fill.

A TOG rating involves applying heat to one side of the fabric and measuring the heat flow to the other side. I cannot see why you cannot do that with a knitted fabric, obviously the scale would be different and it could be given a different name say Sweater Warmth Measurement. Every sweater could have an SWM measurement.

I appreciate the help and hints, but finding shops that stock plain sweaters isn't the problem. The problem is looking at a plain sweater, no pattern, on line it is impossible to work out how thick it is - and that is my problem. If only the sweaters had SWM ratings, I could immediately work out which sweater matched my warmth requirements, that vary from sweater to sweater, depending on what it is being worn under.

If a jumper is a wee bit on the thinner side, I will wear a long sleeve, v neck thermal vest under it. I find that thermal underwear is great. I would rather layer up than wear one thick jumper or cardigan.

But wouldn't the warmth depend where the wool comes from? Like goats, sheep or alpacas, because they all have different properties?

I layer my clothes and wear T-shirts under jumpers . I have some heatgen one from uniglo which are really cosy.
My issue with jumpers is the bobbling. And it happens with lambs wool , cashmere as well as synthetic wool.
I also get tiny holes around front where the zip of my jeans rubs again the fabric . I think it’s because the zip juts out a bit with my meno tum😩

The measurement is value free. As with duvets it doesn't make any differenc what the garment is made of . All the classification is based on is how the difference intemperatures between a heat applied one side and measured the other.

Obviously they use specially designed equipment.