Studying Maths

I'm tempted to suggest that they would say that, wouldn't they? .

Researchers at the University of Oxford found that those who stopped maths after their GCSEs had less gamma-aminobutyric acid, a chemical which is crucial for brain plasticity, than counterparts who pursued maths post-16.

The reduction in the chemical, which works as a neurotransmitter, was found in a key area of the brain that supports maths, memory, learning, reasoning and problem solving – and researchers warned it could put affected students at a disadvantage.

More than 130 students aged 14-18 took part in the study by researchers from the university’s department of experimental psychology. Students over 16 were asked if they had already stopped studying maths, while younger students were asked whether they were planning to give up maths.

Each of them underwent a brain scan and cognitive assessment, and were followed up 19 months later. According to the paper, published in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, researchers were able to spot those who did or did not study maths post-16 based on concentrations of the brain chemical in each student.

They also found the amount of brain chemical present predicted changes in mathematical attainment about 19 months later, yet there were no differences in the levels of the chemical present before the adolescents stopped studying maths.

The findings are significant because pupils in the UK are allowed to drop maths at 16, unlike those in much of the rest of the world. They are likely to be seized upon by those in favour of extending compulsory maths to the age of 18. They also raise questions about the possible impact on children’s cognitive development of disrupted learning due to Covid.

How long does the effect last? They only tested to 19 months

What is their definition of maths, will arithmetic alone be sufficient?

What about those studying statistics, engineering, accountantancy and other sibjects who may use maths in their studies, Do they benefit?

Do we know what the non-Maths students studied instead?

Could you get the same result with Music or languages I wonder?

I find it hard to believe that learning a language does less for brain plasticity than Maths.

Not to mention that being taught something is not the same as learning it. I spent several years at Secondary school avoiding studying Maths. In spite of being present in the classroom ?

Studying music can have the same effects.
We've known that for years.
www.intechopen.com/books/neuroplasticity-insights-of-neural-reorganization/music-and-brain-plasticity-how-sounds-trigger-neurogenerative-adaptations

Studying languages also opens neural pathways in the brain ie increased plasticity.

How long does it last?

X post Peasblossom

Not to mention that being taught something is not the same as learning it. I spent several years at Secondary school avoiding studying Maths. In spite of being present in the classroom

?

I might be wrong Callistemon but I'd guess that if you spent these years avoiding maths when it was compulsory, you were unlikely to have volunteered to study more maths when it was optional.

I do agree that this study seems a bit perfunctory and I hope they will extend it to address some of the questions raised here.

my maths tells me 130 students 14 to 18 isn't many
only 26 in each year.

varian

I might be wrong Callistemon but I'd guess that if you spent these years avoiding maths when it was compulsory, you were unlikely to have volunteered to study more maths when it was optional.

I do agree that this study seems a bit perfunctory and I hope they will extend it to address some of the questions raised here.

I didn't avoid maths, varian - what on earth makes you think that?

Do you not realise that if something is in italics it is quoting someone else's words? I was quoting Peasblossom, I thought it was funny.

Unfortunately, I didn't get the chance to take GCSE maths.
That's because I'm too old but I did get a good mark at GCE but decided to take languages at 'A' level instead.

My brain can't have much plasticity then, although I did use maths (and science) in a later career.

It all sounds like intellectual snobbery to me.

It was me that was a past master at avoiding Maths.

Bet Callistemon is a Professor ?

I failed Maths GCE twice.

I did fail higher the second time?

Sorry Callistemon for thinking it was you who avoided maths.

Peaseblossom, have you considered sitting it again? Now might be a good time. It could be third time lucky. What an achievement that would be!

I did try again at evening classes when I was in my twenties.

The same brain fog descended.

The trouble is I can’t see the point of most of it. What’s it for? I’m never going to need to work out a quadrilateral equation.

In case you think I am totally without hope, I did in my working life (successfully) manage a million pound budget.

??‍♀️

Eldest daughter tried O level maths twice and still failed. But eventually got a Phd in biochemistry.
She also failed cookery, and she's quite a good cook.
I suppose the secret is to find our strengths and weaknesses.

Peasblossom

It was me that was a past master at avoiding Maths.

Bet Callistemon is a Professor ?

Not in Maths!

But, funnily enough, DH and I were discussing Maths this morning. I reckoned the Maths we did for GCE was far in advance of what I needed to pass the exam. The exam was a doddle.

Of course, much has changed since then, well, the methods if not the answers!

I suppose the secret is to find our strengths and weaknesses.

Yes it is. Build on your strengths.

I wonder if revising maths I did know and learning maths that I didn’t learn at school whilst helping GC (primary and secondary) during lockdown will have added the missing plasticity to my brain.

I think maths is a subject where you suddenly hit a ceiling. I had no problem with O'level, did humanities A levels and then after university I started to study statistics. This required me to get to A level standard. I struggled and had to resit the exam, but when I got past it, I simply couldn't grasp it. DH was endlessly patient helping me, but I simply did not understand the concepts.

DH did several Alevels in maths and got nearly full marks, but refused to buckle to school pressure to read the subject at ubiversity, because he did not think he would be able to do it. However he was more than capable of doing the maths required to become an engineer.

All of us have a sticking point somewhere, some struggle even to get to GCSE. and others of us hit ceilings at various levels after that.

Which Maths though?
Pure Maths, Applied Maths? Or both?

DN did both but did better at Pure Maths because she liked it.
DS disliked Pure Maths but took Applied Maths and uses it every day in his career.

GABA is a neurotransmitter that inhibits or slows the brain’s functions. This activity produces effects such as:

relieving anxiety
reducing stress
improving sleep
preventing brain damage
The brain naturally releases GABA at the end of a day to promote sleepiness and allow a person to rest. Some of the medications doctors prescribe to induce sleep and reduce anxiety may also increase the action of GABA.

Medical benefits of increased GABA
Some experts have suggested that increased levels of GABA may have benefits, but the evidence is not clear. According to a 2019 review, GABA has anti-microbial, anti-seizure, and antioxidant properties and may help treat and prevent conditions such as:

diabetes
high blood pressure
insomnia

www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/326847

I think forcing all students to take Maths to 'A' level might increase anxiety, sleeplessness and increase blood pressure in those who do not have an aptitude for the subject and who wished to take other 'A' levels or pursue another course, thus negating any

The findings are significant because pupils in the UK are allowed to drop maths at 16, unlike those in much of the rest of the world.

I think much wider research would need to be carried out including students who took other subjects, students from around the world where Maths is compulsory post GCE level etc but does that mean that the subject is taught to as high a level in other countries?

It's certainly interesting.
Should I do some Sudoko before going to sleep rather than read a book?
GABA capsules are available from health food shops for those who hate Maths.

thus negating any benefits

Apologies, the adverts are covering the message box again.

Peasblossom

I did try again at evening classes when I was in my twenties.

The same brain fog descended.

The trouble is I can’t see the point of most of it. What’s it for? I’m never going to need to work out a quadrilateral equation.

In case you think I am totally without hope, I did in my working life (successfully) manage a million pound budget.

??‍♀️

I failed GCE maths, abysmally.

Tried again 20 odd years later at evening classes.

Knew at first lesson it was a mistake, but kept going. Can remember crying, begging my 16 year old son to help me with my homework, real role reversal!

Failed again, not quite so badly.

Worked in a bank my whole working life, no problem.

Peaseblossom said that she'd never needed to solve quadratic equations at any time in her career and I'm sure that applies to most folk.

I am not a teacher or retired teacher but I've always loved maths and so I have done a bit of home schooling with grandchildren recently. online. I was surprised that there are an amazing number of YouTube videos showing the different methods of solving quadratic equations. Who knew?

Perhaps if our generation had access to these YouTube videos far more would have given up on maths.

I enjoyed maths and passed O level then dropped it.
I used to go round to my friend's house and we did homework and revision together.
We liked algebra best.